October 25, 2017


Chairman Ian Murray called the meeting to order at 7:37 p.m.


Planning Clerk Linda McCabe called the roll: Chairman Ian Murray present, Laurie

Griffen present, Patrick Hanehan present, Robert McConnell present, Joseph

Lewandowski present, Brandon Myers present, George Olsen - present,

Alternate Christopher Koval - present.


Also attending: Town Engineer Ken Martin, Highway Superintendent Don Ormsby, Jeff Mancini, Michele McClure, Jim Jennings, Barbara Faraone, Sharon Urban, Donna Hladik, Dave Wallingford, Chris Benn, James Stanton, Tom Carringi, Peter Beech, Jan & Paul Murphy, Walt Borisenok, Thomas Bonds, Tom & Edith Rubinson Yannios, Kate & Hub Miller, Gary Anderson, S. Clements, Jean Seiler, Gary Squires, Darin & Jennifer Palmetto, Marc Limeri, Paul Markessinis, Sergei Niremburg and other interested persons. (Sign-in sheet is on file in the Clerk's office)


A motion was made by Laurie Griffen, seconded by Partrick Hanehan, to accept the meeting minutes of September 27, 2017 and October 10, 2017. Chairman Ian Murray aye, Laurie Griffen aye, Patrick Hanehan aye, Joseph Lewandowski aye, Brandon Myers aye, Robert McConnell aye, George Olsen - aye.

Carried 7- 0



Chairman Ian Murray stated the Board is holding public hearing for preliminary plat and setting the date for SEQR review for the Cedar Bluff subdivision. He then asked how many present wished to speak during the public hearing portion of the meeting. Seeing many, he stated that the privilege of the floor will be limited to 3 minutes. Normally the Board allows 5 minutes of speaking time, but as the Board wants to hear all who wish to be heard, they must lower it to 3 minutes per person once the public hearing is opened.


Public Hearing for Preliminary Plat of Cedar Bluff Subdivision

and setting date for SEQR Review


John Witt, Witt Construction #15-05

563 N. Broadway

Saratoga Springs, NY 12866

S/B/L 193.-1-17, 193.-1-18, 193.18-1-55 Lake Residential, Rural District II, Rural District

Location: 142 Cedar Bluff Rd. (Co. Rd. 71)


Returning Applicant seeks a 32 lot major subdivision.


Attorney Libby Coreno, Carter, Conboy Attorneys & Counselors at Law, appeared on behalf of the Applicant. She stated this proposal is for a 32 lot conservation subdivision with a significant amount of open space; 31 new lots and 1 existing lot. They are before the Board for preliminary plat approval of this project. She then proceeded with a power point presentation, reviewing the proposed lots and the areas of open space. The total amount of land is 111.6 acres, with 18.6 acres of unbuildable land and 93 acres of buildable land. They will have 54.27 acres (22+/- acres to the west and 31+/- acres to the east), for open space land; beyond the required amount, which leaves 31 acres of buildable lots. They have forestry proposed for the western portion of the site, and also propose to attach that land to Lot 1 or Lot 20 and restrict it pursuant to deed. On the east side, she showed the area they anticipate clearing for farming or for some other educational or agricultural use, consistent with the Open Space legislation. She stated this is adjacent to an existing farmland on the east side, and they propose appropriate deed covenants and language to restrict it and she referenced 400-14(H). She then reviewed the Town of Saratoga Conservation Subdivision Regulations, Zoning Regulations, Right to Farm law and the Town's Comprehensive Plan.


Attorney Libby Coreno then went through the milestones of this application to date:


August 2015: they met with the Planning Board to discuss conceptual plan for subdivision

November 2015: sketch plan was submitted, wetland study was done, completed survey of the land and the Planning Board conducted a site walk-through

April 2016: they conducted an engineering presentation to the Board

January and February 2016: two workshops were held by the Planning Board for the Applicant

June 2016: well water surveys were completed, forestry management plan presented and they received conceptual subdivision approval

December 2016 and March 2017: they had several meetings with the Planning Board to review environmental data, open space information and stormwater concerns

Summer of 2017 to the Fall of 2017: they received and responded to multiple Town Engineering comments and questions

October 10, 2017: a third workshop was held by the Planning Board for the Applicant

Attorney Libby Coreno stated that Chairman Ian Murray gave an excellent overview of the project to date, at the October 10, 2017 workshop as well as the steps going forward. She reiterated the next step will be SEQR determination of significance; a positive declaration, a negative declaration, a conditional negative declaration or incomplete. Then preliminary conservation subdivision development design approval, with or without conditions, or disapproval with findings; if approved or approved with conditions, all conditions are to be met and then final submission and presentation of the final plat design, next a public hearing will be held and then the vote to approve or disapprove with findings of the final plat.


She stated they have responded to Technical Comments of the Planning Board over the past couple of weeks and then went through those questions and comments and their responses as of 10/24/2017:

Comment: Test well locations are to be on Lots 1, 2, 10, 11, 12, 18, 23, 27, 28 & 32.

Response: Test locations are acceptable to them.

Comment: Cable tool drilling method recommended.

Response: Commented noted.

Comment: Submit drilling plan to Planning Board in compliance with 10 NYCRR Part 5.

Response: Drilling plan will be submitted to Town Engineer Ken Martin for review and approval.

Comment: Monitor any neighboring wells within a "reasonable distance" as defined by expert.

Response: Comment noted.

Comment: Drawing comments #2, 3, 4, 6, 9, 10, 12, 13 & 14

Response: Comments noted and will be addressed.

Comment: Relocating Lots 2, 20 & 30 due to slope disturbance.

Response: Area of impact is largely limited to driveway disturbance, specifically in respect to Lot 20. They are amenable to alternative designs for Lot 20 to keep them below 17%.


Comment: Double arrow for Lot 20 questioned.

Response: Indicates connection to deed ownership of open space to Lot 20.


Attorney Libby Coreno then stated she had a couple of things to add concerning Archeological comments:

Comment: Hill Rd. site needs to have a Phase III or be completely avoided.

Response: They propose Phase III to be completed ONLY IF project is approved. State Historic Preservation Office (SHPO) advises non-disturbance if the project is denied. Non-disturbance only used in cases of human remains. They also propose that Phase III be a condition of final subdivision approval.

Comment: Can Lots 7, 8, 10 & 12 be avoided?

Response: Lots 8 & 10 may be avoided, Lots 7 & 12 cannot.

Attorney Libby Coreno added there is a proposed "no build line" on the ridge for Lots 9, 10 & 11 as show on Map G1. Any selective tree removal below that line will be limited to no more than 30% removal of trees, with 10" - 12" diameter breast height and to be identified with Town Building Inspector in their lot clearing plan. She then went through their sample lot clearing plan showing sample home envelopes with driveways, sample drywells, sample rain gardens and sample disturbance limit lines. Next was the proposed selective lot clearing, proposed steep slope protections, proposed lot clearing procedure, proposed stormwater pollution prevention plan (SWPPP), proposed well installation and hydrology and proposed subdivision conditions. As part of final approval, a final hydrology data report will be submitted to Town Engineer Ken Martin demonstrating compliance with state and local water flow and quality standards.


Chairman Ian Murray requested that a printed copy of this information be submitted for the record and also for the Board. He then stated in the presentation, referencing the west side connecting the open space to Lot 1 or 20; he and Town Engineer Ken Martin thought the tie-in was with Lot 32, but there's a tie-in from Lot 20 to the 2.13 acres on the side of Wright Rd.


Kevin Hastings responded it is tied to Lot 20.


Chairman Ian Murray replied that technically it cannot be considered open space.


Kevin Hastings said they will take it back out.


Chairman Ian Murray stated in the power point presentation, it was referenced relocating Lots 2, 20 & 30 because of the driveways.


Attorney Libby Coreno clarified that the house is to be relocated on Lot 30. With respect to Lot 20, beginning at the west end, they believe it may be a longer driveway up but there's a way to keep it at 11% grade.


Chairman Ian Murray stated his concern isn't that it can be moved, it's the impacts and excessive soil movement that will have to be done to make it work on Lots 20 & 2.


John Witt responded on Lot 2, they can go lower with the driveway, the driveway can go in flat with a 10% slope and a full walk-out; that way Lot 2 will have minimal disturbance. Lot 20, they'll rearrange the driveway to eliminate the large cut, move the house higher.


Chairman Ian Murray stated his opinion is moving the driveway over on Lot 2 will not satisfy what the Board is looking for. There should be avoidance of Lot 2 and it should go away. If anything, that should be looked at for their Storm Water Pollution Prevention Plan (SWPPP).

Lot 20, with the impacts of the slopes etcetera, it too should go away. The impacts are too great to make Lot 20 work.

Chairman Ian Murray then stated at the workshop it wasn't deed restrictions they had talked about, it was deed notifications for the stormwater controls that are going to be in place on the lots and also the clearing regulations and clearing limits that are on there. He then asked if there were any Board questions, there were none.


Proof of Notice having been furnished by newspaper on October 15, 2017, Chairman Ian Murray opened the Public Hearing at 8:17 p.m., asking those wishing to speak to please stand at the podium, use the microphone, state their name and address and limit their comments to 3 minutes. He added the Board will accept written comments as well.


The following persons spoke of their concerns with the Cedar Bluff Subdivision project; preservation of trees and greenways, ground water, State Environmental Quality Review, erosion, storm water runoff into the lake, traffic and roadways, pesticides going into the lake, tics, as well as concerns with NYS DOT not taking proper care of RT. 9P. :


Hubert Miller, 97 Brown Rd.

Marge McShane, 34 Hill Rd.

Lauren Kirkwood, 26 Hill Rd.

Paul Murphy, 36 Hill Rd.

Edith Rubinson, 43 Hill Rd.

Gary Anderson, 44 Spruce Ridge Rd. (NYS DOT concern)

Barbara Farone, 42 Spruce Ridge Rd. (NYS DOT concern)

Paul Markesinnis, 154 Brown Rd.

Mark Lemeri, 68 Trombley Rd.

Kim Finnegan, 1235 A Rt. 9P

Tom Carringi, 1236 Rt. 9P


Chairman Ian Murray asked three times if anyone else would like to speak; no one spoke.


Chairman Ian Murray then stated he is stopping the Public Hearing for this evening, seeing as all who wanted to speak and be heard by the Board, had spoken. Public Hearing will be continued at the November meeting, to give opportunity to those who may want to speak. He stated they will adhere to a strict time limit of 3 minutes.


Attorney Justin Grassi stated the Board will finish and close the public hearing for preliminary plat next month. Once SEQR is completed and determination is made, they will deem the application complete. Then the Board can act on preliminary plat or not act upon it. Once final plat is submitted and review is completed by the Planning Board, another public hearing will be held on the final plat and the Board will approve or disapprove. Public Hearing must be

conducted within 62 days of SEQR determination.


Chairman Ian Murray stated the Board is running preliminary plat and SEQR review in parallel. He then stated there will be no rush to judgment. SEQR workshop may take two meetings, as the Board knows the issues they need to go through. Currently the Applicant only has the trace


study completed. Once the Applicant has their study complete, the hydrologist the Board has hired will go through this.


Old Business: none


New Business: SEQR Workshop will be held November 13, 2017 at 7 p.m.


A motion was made by Patrick Hanehan, seconded by Robert McConnell to adjourn the

meeting at 9:25 p.m. Chairman Ian Murray aye, Laurie Griffen aye, Patrick Hanehan aye, Joseph Lewandowski aye, Robert McConnell aye, Brandon Myers aye, George Olsen - aye, Alternate Christopher Koval - aye.

Carried 7 - 0

Meeting Adjourned


The next regular meeting will be held Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 7:30 PM.


Respectfully submitted,


Linda A. McCabe

Planning Clerk